honey i suckle the kids | hidden lives | five.tv

Aug 28, 2006

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On now!

honey i suckle the kids | hidden lives | five.tv

Just seen an ad for this – anyone we know know anyone on there?

I’ve never thought as elimination communication as more controversial than home education, but it’s possibly got more of a eugh factor. Get the feeling this is going to be sensational rather than sensitive. And isn’t it attach*ment* parenting, rather than attached?

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Added during show – I really don’t think this is doing any favours to the practises it is depicting 🙁 If I’d seen this before I started with any of the parenting practises it’s on about, I’d probably have thought twice about trying them!

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Comments

40 responses to “honey i suckle the kids | hidden lives | five.tv”

Allie
27 August 2006
Yes, it is attachment parenting – or so I’ve always thought. I loved that bit about a ‘poo smeared kitchen floor’ – has to have been written by someone who has never had babies or little kids in their life, you could sense the shudder! Whatever you choose to do about your babies toilet needs, poo is just a fact of parent life, isn’t it? You get it on your fingers, on the bed, on your clothes and (if you’re unlucky!) on your kitchen floor!
Sounds like it’ll be a shock, horror, ‘look at these weird people’ programme… Yawn….
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Caroline
27 August 2006
All I can say is – I thought parenting was hard enough already!!
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Nic
27 August 2006
Yep, that’s going to be another ridicule and wonder at the weirdos type affair isn’t it.
I’ve always thought it was ‘attachment’ too rather than ‘attached’ – but of course attached seems quite correct in the case of breastfeeding and ECing your brood! 😆
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Deb
27 August 2006
Whoever wrote that really doesn’t seem to have come to grips with any of the concepts involved. From getting the name of AP wrong, to eschewing “all the props we use to make life cleaner and quieter” (heck, that’s often *why* I breastfeed! LOL), they’ve missed the point. The description of positive discipline is inaccurate, I don’t think WHO says anything about weaning at age four, and although we don’t EC, I do know that it doesn’t rely on watching a child constantly. It does all sound much harder, as it’s been written there – but like home-educating, much of it isn’t harder, it’s just different. I just hope the programme-makers had a better understanding than the writer of that :-
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Clare
27 August 2006
I think you’re right – this is going to be a typical Channel 5 freak show, sadly, and although I’ll watch it, I can’t say I’m looking forward to it! The clip I saw showed some pretty obnoxious children too – I guess just to prove how ‘stupid’ and ‘unworkable’ attachment parenting is? Of course, they’re not going to show a programme saying ‘look how it can be done? these children are lovely and well-adjusted and happy and secure’ because that would also be saying ‘most mainstream parents are doing it wrong’! 🙁
Cx
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Kath
28 August 2006
So far I think it could be worse, but they’re not showing things in a positive light really, are they? I’ve met Liz through the ABM and they filmed at the ABM conference. Funny they had to get so many Americans to film in the end though – presumably most UK folk know what Channel 5’s reputation is like.
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Jax
28 August 2006
I was thinking Liz and Gary looked familiar – weren’t they at camp last year (’05)? You could well be right about the channel 5 thing and UK parents though.
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Sarah
28 August 2006
Please tell me A Different Life didn’t make us look so freaky!
Just caught the last 15 minutes of it and yes … yawn …
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Jax
28 August 2006
nope, it didn’t.
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Chris F
29 August 2006
Oh, no much much worse Sarah….
Didn’t even bother to watch it, the title and the trailer were enough for me
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Deb
29 August 2006
I didn’t watch it because we don’t have a tv that tunes in.
Or rather, I forgot we had a tv that tunes in.
We didn’t have one for ages, and then we were given one about five months ago, and I think it’s been on maybe twice, and not for about four months. And it has only just occurred to me, reading this at 7.40 a.m. the next morning, that I could actually have watched it.
Not that I’m very bothered about missing it, just LOLing at myself for not realising I could have!
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dawniy
29 August 2006
hello people,
I would just like to say that liz and gary had to endure weeks of filming at all hours for this programme, they are very genuine people and yes they were at the camp. Liz has been here today, to the blog ring , she has read Jax’s blog and these comments and she is very hurt by what she has read.
I think it is one of those times that people need to remove the planks from their own eyes before trying to remove splinters from others. You know let him without sin cast the first stone. Liz may not be active on out blog ring but she is a constant reader and supporter of muddle puddle,it is a real shame you haven’t seen fit to support her. They and their family have dared to stick out there necks and leap into the unknown of the public glare and criticism. It is sad that we criticise our own, I am so sorry for Liz having read here today, it has really hurt her.
your friend and Liz’s friend too
Dawniy xx
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jill
29 August 2006
Shame the programme made these people look like freaks. You could almost sense the presenter secretly sniggering. It also made me feel “oh no, not another craze coming over from America”. However, there’s a lot of sense in what they are saying, although watching other people’s birth videos was just a bit too “eeugh”. A thought-provoking programme that should be on a mainstream channel, shown in schools and colleges, and to health professionals. From a mum with 3 grownup children.
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Sarah
29 August 2006
I don’t think anyone here is criticising the people featured in the programme, only the way the programme was put together and presented. I still think it is a shame – as most of us *do* support the principles of attachment parenting, so there is no need for anyone to feel hurt by what has been said here.
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Chris
29 August 2006
‘criticise our own’……..err who exactly are our own?
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Tim
29 August 2006
I can’t see that there is anything here for Liz to be hurt about. No-one has said anything which is in any way critical of her. The only criticism (positive or negative) I can see is criticism of the programme.
I do think though if you put yourself up for one of these shows you are entirely in the hands of the producers, who can cut and splice to their hearts delight until they get precisely what they want out of it and present any story they want. What comes out is mostly sensationalist crap which fails to address the subject matter in any way at all.
If you are not thick-skinned enough to live with that then the answer is to not do the programme.
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dawniy
29 August 2006
Maybe there is no need to be hurt by what has been said here , that doesn’t change the fact that Liz does feel hurt by what people have said here and there is clearly criticism not least “The clip I saw showed some pretty obnoxious children too ” they were Liz’s children so she is rightly hurt to read that here.-
and by our own I mean people who are/have been members of the muddle puddle /early years group and as Jax reminds us, has been on the camp last year.
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Jax
29 August 2006
dawniy, with the greatest of respect, I don’t want to play chinese whispers on my blog. If Liz feels hurts, or even if she doesn’t, and she’d like right of reply to any perceived criticism or comments, she is very welcome to comment or to send me something that I’ll put in a post for her, but I’d like you to stop speaking for her now.
I don’t know which children the snippet above is referring to, – perhaps it would be more clear to say “showed some pretty obnoxious behaviour” but that would be merely my interpretation and of course may not be what Clare meant (I’m not going to put words into her mouth either).
I had to go and check the camp list to verify my suspicion that I’d met Liz and Gary before – I should imagine I’m not the only one who doesn’t really remember them as ppl as such. And as such, I don’t think many of the posters here think of them as anyone they know.
As Tim has said, the criticism is of the programme, and I’m not going to prevent that discussion – I’d like to discuss it further in fact, so here’s fair warning that I may well be back with more to say on the topic.
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Tim
29 August 2006
If someone brought a film camera round here on an average day they are pretty much guaranteed to capture some pretty obnoxious behavioural displays. They might see some from our children too. That is among the many reasons I would not want to get involved in any programme of this type where I had anything less than full editorial control.
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Sarah
29 August 2006
pmsl Tim … I well remember a couple of times I yanked Anna away from the camera when we were filming and hissed at her to behave herself otherwise the whole world would think that home educated children were spoilt brats … and I also well remember a couple of times that *I* nearly lost my cool with having to repeat ‘spontaneous’ things over and over again for however many takes the cameras needed!
I was so glad that in our case it was only us involved, it really was trying to capture the child’s pov rather than making any judgement call on the adults involved, and that by the end of it I was fairly sure we’d convinced the director that home ed really was wonderful; he gave me the chance to look over the narration to make sure we were happy with it etc.
I would be very interested to hear whether Liz and Gary were actually happy with the finished programme.
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HelenHaricot
29 August 2006
rofl sarah. of course SB is a perfect angel, never sulks, strops or wails – rofl!! I can imagine it would be easy to capture her in 2 very diferent ways, depending on the ‘angle’
however, I see only criticism of the programme here – which I didn’t watch, so won’t comment on.
blogs are personal discussion leaping boards. Jax and Tim are quite used to contradictory POV being aired in their comments, both pro and against whatever they have posted about. I certainly have not always agreed, but not felt hurt by our disagreements.
If you go on tv, you are inviting people to make snap character opinions on you with just the edited tape as the editor sees fit to play it. I thought sarah’s came out fine – as did Katy and Becca on theirs. its not always the case though. we couldn’t go on tc, as I believe it adds a stone to you – something I can ill afford!
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Jax
29 August 2006
I wouldn’t dream of letting a camera near Big right at the moment, and even Small could hang me out to dry if he felt so inclined.
I’m assuming you mean only criticism of the programme, rather than criticism of the ppl involved? 😉
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dawniy
30 August 2006
Jax with all due respect I wasn’t playing chinese whispers I was answering Chris who asked what I meant by ‘our own’ and replying to Tim.
Liz is a member of EYHE and a regular reader of our blogs.
I was voicing my own opinion , Liz didn’t even know I was commenting.
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Chris F
30 August 2006
Well as others have said, I don’t see any cricism of Liz and Gary particulary – one comment about children that is all, which doesn’t mention which children.. TBH, it’s not clear to me what planks in particular we should be removing from our eyes anyway. OK I guess there you could see an implied criticism of people who choose to appear on such a program given the general view we seem to have of such programs in general, esp. on Channel 5. Though my view is that I would probably steer clear of such things with a barge pole (to mix metaphors) I think that if somne one else wants to do so, allwell and good. Surely no one should be in any doubt of the risk of misrepresntation/criticism that they run nowadays with such reality TV.
On a more general point, As for ‘our own’ . I don’t see that just becuase someone is a home eder of whatever other criteria might be used to lump us togther means we should not criticise other people
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Chris
30 August 2006
Indeed Chris F. I really don’t like some of your trousers 🙂
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Tim
30 August 2006
You mean you like some of them? :-O
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Chris
30 August 2006
Well tbh, no, I was just trying to be less harsh (I know, I know, hard to believe) because in certain circumstances (his first name for example) he is one of ours, or rather mine.
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Chris F
30 August 2006
hey, I don’t like some of my trousers…..
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Tim
30 August 2006
You’ve got sunglasses, what’s the problem? 🙂
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Alison
30 August 2006
I’d quite like to see Chris P and Chris F dressed as each other ….
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Liz
30 August 2006
Thanks for asking for our opinions, eventually.
If anyone is interested in how we felt about the programme you could look at these blogs in the comments sections:
http://ourlearningtogether.com/
http://playingitbyear.homeschooljournal.net/2006/08/29/honey-i-suckle-the-kids/
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HelenHaricot
31 August 2006
Alison, didn’t they go to the halloween thing last year dressed as chris and anti-chris for their costumes?
obviously, to those not primed to this stunning bit of costumery, there was no actual visible difference from normal, but!
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Jax
31 August 2006
Wish I’d seen that 😉
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susan
1 September 2006
I have just watched the programme and realised it is actually the parents rather than the children that are attached. the kids are being brought up to think that this is the natural way of life but unfortunately when they come to find their own identification it will come as a shock to discover mummys breast is no longer their best friend.Regarding chastising whatever happened to setting ground rules to give kids a sense of security im sorry but i am a mother myself and whilst i have never breastfed my daughter takes the count of three to do as i ask if not i get off my backside and see she does, how else will she ever learn to live by rules and learn lessons in life if we are all so easy going about “what the child wants” all i really want to say is stand up accept your responsibilities and be parents, you have had your childhood.
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Chris F
1 September 2006
Ding, ding 🙂
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Tim
1 September 2006
:troll:
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HelenJ
1 September 2006
I think Susan’s is a valid alternative point to the series – and don’t you troll me Tim!
My particularly parenting practices are irrelevant, but somewhere on the spectrum between TCS and TAS depending on which particular bit of parentry is being microscoped. Like all things, education, bf, discipline, there are many ‘right’ ways to do it to suit the family concerend, giving a balance to parent and child. thus said, there are also many ‘wrong’ [and i use the word with a grimace] ways to do it too, where the balance is way off kilter one way or the other.
the problem is, the point at which it feels balanced for one family, is almost certainly diferent from the next, and it is where we are on the scale that decides how we react to other parenting techniques, rather than how that scale seems to be working for them.
I didn’t watch the programme, but I’m guessing that Liz was hoping for a bit of live and let live for her parenting style – just because you see mine at the worst on occasions doesn’t mean that we are not mostly fine – which must be the same for most of us?
Bringing up children is just a social experiment nightmare – and I’m not about to follow any guidelines either!
so, carry on Susan, and respond back those that disagree – after all Jax’s blog – i think – is all about opening up points for discussion and seeing where it leads
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HelenJ
1 September 2006
chris
http://www.flickr.com/photos/scrumble/57702728/in/set-1249180/
and anti chris
http://www.flickr.com/photos/scrumble/57742269/in/set-1249180/
a very subtle flavour to their costumes I feel!
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HelenJ
1 September 2006
oh, and the HelenJ on dawniy’s blog isn’t me – I am sure that that was apparent to most people.
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kirsten
2 November 2010
i just think there mad doing things like that the kids will start to argue when there older and when they cant handle them thats there own fault i was smacked for being bad but that wasnt very many but i did know i did wrong
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