Are there things you can't learn at home?

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13 responses to “Are there things you can't learn at home?”

1. 

   SallyM

   18 June 2008

   Well I think its something that is very dependent on the child. DS1 having an ASD isn’t very sympathetic at noticing or even tolerating differences in other children, not even when he knows its because they are AS like him. DS3 still has very poor theory of mind and often tells me to “just get it from my brain” when he can’t be bothered to speak so I’m not holding out any hope for him! DS2 notices by virtue of the fact that they are on different tables grouped by ability so he knows that green group aren’t so good at writing as his group but more of them are better at sports than him. I think he is far more sympathetic, the teachers quite often pair one from a higher group with one from a lower group in pair work and I have noticed that he is kind and considerate to them. That said he is that kind of child, he does look after small children and nurture them so he could well have been the same had he not gone to school. I think the only thing school adds to the mix is that opportunity to see a wide range of differences in lots of people, there is no reason to think that with enough people experience a non schooled child wouldn’t have the same. As for Big not being happy at school, I wonder if its something to do with you being there? I know that even as an adult at toddler group the other parents wouldn’t say things in front of me in case I repeated them to my Mum (TA at the school where the group was) and it was the same as a child, the kids didn’t treat us the same as our Mum was staff. May be way off base but something you might not have thought of 🙂

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2. 

   Sarah

   18 June 2008

   Hmm, unfortunately I think my children have learnt to be relatively scathing too (as I probably am, tbh – even though of course none of us are geniuses in this family!), not sure any other school would teach Big anything different, iyswim – as Sally says, it’s a personality thing I would imagine. As a bright kid it *is* incredibly frustrating when people around you aren’t as quick as you.
   Unsure what it is you think would be better about group dynamics in a larger setting? I guess going back to full time HE is off the list of choices atm? Or wouldn’t she want that anyway? Questions questions, sorry – but it is slightly unclear what you’re trying to explore, have you eaten and rested yet?!!!

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3. 

   Jax

   18 June 2008

   I do a fairly good line in sarcasm, though I like to think I also do a fairly good line in understanding and patience, and given that I focus on the majority of the special needs kids in our classroom I’m guessing I do it fairly well. Maybe Big just needs to learn when which is acceptable 😉
   Group dynamics, just wondered whether more exposure to more ppl might be good for her – and one of the reasons for that is she’s desperate for local friends, there still aren’t that many ppl at school, and three weeks at Brownies has resulted in her learning one child’s name 🙁 All options are open, but I don’t think home education would satisfy her right now, she really is a social animal (no idea where she gets it from, neither of us is!)
   Sally, I did try to comment, but I think it was while Tim was cleaning house – think my presence in school is in some way quite difficult for her – she loves having me there for hit and run hugs when she wants but doesn’t want me to be her teacher in her class (which I’m not very much of the time, but in the longer run might be!)

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4. 

   Jax

   18 June 2008

   oh and Sarah, resting is this and Tim’s in the kitchen now 🙂

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5. 

   Sarah

   18 June 2008

   Anna is the same (social animal thing I mean!), she wouldn’t dream of not being at school now. One of the main positives about school for her was fulfilling that need, which otherwise wasn’t met even through groups etc. We long ago decided that we weren’t bothered about the educational side of it.
   So – are there any other local school options? In some ways it would be a shame, given that you have just got the job, moved house etc., and all seems relatively simple in terms of who is where, for once, do you really want to change all that?!
   And yes, learning when which is acceptable is probably all it is, I’m guessing – and that just comes with age/maturity. Even then some adults I know haven’t managed to learn it.

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6. 

   Merry

   18 June 2008

   Hm.
   I don’t think you need school for it, in fact i’d say school (not your school, most schools) might be a place where the model is that everyone SHOULD be the same. That’s the goal and they don’t have time to adapt to needs much, so the chances of pupils learning other people learn differently are likely to be small. You might learn that people ARE different, but that isn’t often shown up as a good thing at that age, more a source of discomfort and even ridicule, so possibly school is a worse place than home to be able to absorb and respect peoples learning differences.
   Did that make sense? (Also tired and hungry.)
   I don’t recall, right up to sixth form, having any concept that people had different learning styles, i just knew i was better at some things than some people and worse at some things than other people. It occurred to me i had aptitudes or failings, but not that my mind worked differently or i needed a different input style. Nor, i would say, even in my privileged education, did it occur to anyone else that if, for example, you related decimals to money or fractions to cakes, i’d grasp the concept. If it didn’t occur to the teachers, i don’t think the rest of us were likely to pay the notion much mind!
   We knew that J, in our class, was seriously peculiar but we never once considered she couldn’t help the way she was (some genetic fragile x type version of autism) – we were frightened and bewildered by her (at 15) but unsupported and largely, as a group, fairly horrid. And it never occurred to our teachers to mould our behaviour by trying to put us into her mind.
   Can you learn this at home? Well, i don’t think i have exceptional children, but certainly i think my eldest has a concept of this. She has known, from a young age, how to manage Maddy and how to move her on from a place she is in, she also knows that it is pointless to try and move Maddy on from a pint to early. She has just always known that. She’s never impatient with Maddy, though she knows perfectly well that she can be so with the younger two. And i hear her talking to the little ones now, when they want something and (i’d like to think) because she has grown up with parents who will say “try to think of it this way… or maybe if you imagine this..” she does the same. I’ve heard her adapt something like that and it isn’t an age thing; she “gets” that M will only understand a thing if you build it up step by step but that Amelie will understand if you say “this happens if you do this?” Maddy, of course, will never get it, anymore than her father does, because you can’t develop the Theory of Mind in someone who doesn’t have the seed to grow in the first place.
   What my kids struggle with is understanding why people behave stupidly and short change themselves; the idea of talking in Brownies and wasting 5 minutes of playing time because Brown Owl gets angry is a mystery to them, they just don’t get why people chatter. But for that, i do think that social contact is essential – and that’s the crux, isn’t it? It isn’t “do you do the learning at home” or “do you do it in school” its that you can only build up a decent bank of knowledge to draw on if you meet different people a lot and spend time interacting.
   Any help? I may have forgotten the question….

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7. 

   Merry

   18 June 2008

   Dear lord… “from a pint to early”… “from a point too early”!!!!

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8. 

   Tim

   18 June 2008

   Merry, cheers :chug:

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9. 

   HelenHaricot

   18 June 2008

   TBH jax, i would def try giving you all a chance in the same school a bit longer. after all, a lot of the point of your job change and move was to facilitate bigs next stage in a montessori school. i can’t believe in a state school that there will be much individualised growth and thought going on. as the cleverest in my middle school, i was given workbooks and dumped in the corned. whats more, i was given the answer book as well to mark myself, so i just cheated and whiled the time away. [erm, i wonder why we home ed?]
   i think staying where she is at the moment may be a social learning opportunity if thats what you are after.

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10. 

    Kirsty

    19 June 2008

    one of the things I regret most about being at school was the way I would downplay if I knew answers to questions and suchlike in order to not be known as the ‘smart’ one. It really did inhibit me and I think I’d have done so much better in school if I hadn’t done it. To me being more popular was more important!
    I don’t know if that’s helpful. I guess I did know that other people learnt differently and I tried to compensate so I didn’t make them look stupid (and me get the ‘smart’ kids treatment) but really it had it’s drawbacks too.

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11. 

    SallyM

    20 June 2008

    DS2 is similar when I’m helping in his class. He cries & moans at me if I can’t go in for some reason but once we are actually *at* school I’m not allowed to look at him or talk to him LOL!
    I think Big will learn from whatever contact she has with other people and the situation with the new child is a very hard learning experience for her, more so when you are there on hand seeing every possible failing rather than only hearing about it if it became a huge problem IYSWIM so maybe if you try to draw a line between school & home for her so she doesn’t feel that you are picking her up at home on what she does at school and then get her class teacher at school to do some focused stuff on when which behaviours are appropriate (do you work like that? Our lot would have like a circle time on it or something) and see how she goes?

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12. 

    Jax

    20 June 2008

    apparently peace education is on the schedule for next week. I am thinking that perhaps I need to draw her a line though – it can’t be that pleasant feeling you’ve nowhere to escape to.

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13. 

    Allie

    21 June 2008

    Like others, I would say that school, for me, was certainly not a place where I learned to respect other people’s learning styles – or other people much. Size of group is a big part of that, I think. Leo has been known to make the odd tactless comment (“hmm, you can’t read very well…) but has improved in this regard by being in a small, consistent group of kids on a regular basis. I think he’s figured out that everyone is good at something or other and that he isn’t necessarily the best at everything 😉
    Ours both like to be at activities without us and really benefit from the input of other adults – but they quite like it if we’re on the rota at a group, or turn up early. I guess being at school together is a bit different but it must take time to settle.

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