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	<title>Comments on: I can complain too!</title>
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	<link>http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/2005/05/27/i-can-complain-too/</link>
	<description>montessori at school, autonomous at home, all learning together</description>
	<pubDate>Wed, 19 Nov 2008 13:35:08 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Tim</title>
		<link>http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/2005/05/27/i-can-complain-too/#comment-5648</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 May 2005 10:17:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=869#comment-5648</guid>
		<description>Chris, I don't think we are going to agree on this. You appear to think that the NHS can do no wrong and exists principally for the benefit of its managers and doctors. I think that it is exists for the benefit of patients and that there is tremendous room for improvement in the way it uses its resources (as an aside it would be a help if it started treating nurses a little better).

At the end of the day, my real complaint, which triggered this thread is not specifically about the NHS at all, since I have experienced similar bad practice in business and in private life. It is just that the NHS has institutionalised it.

Put simply, if you arrange an appointment with someone to meet at a specific time, then you should make every effort to keep that apointment and you should be realistic in your scheduling in order to achieve that. If you cannot keep the appointment, or will be late, then you should make every reasonable effort to minimise the inconvenience you cause. Frankly, the fact that you are a doctor, a celebrity, a senior manager, a parent, old, young is no reason to depart from this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris, I don&#8217;t think we are going to agree on this. You appear to think that the NHS can do no wrong and exists principally for the benefit of its managers and doctors. I think that it is exists for the benefit of patients and that there is tremendous room for improvement in the way it uses its resources (as an aside it would be a help if it started treating nurses a little better).</p>
<p>At the end of the day, my real complaint, which triggered this thread is not specifically about the NHS at all, since I have experienced similar bad practice in business and in private life. It is just that the NHS has institutionalised it.</p>
<p>Put simply, if you arrange an appointment with someone to meet at a specific time, then you should make every effort to keep that apointment and you should be realistic in your scheduling in order to achieve that. If you cannot keep the appointment, or will be late, then you should make every reasonable effort to minimise the inconvenience you cause. Frankly, the fact that you are a doctor, a celebrity, a senior manager, a parent, old, young is no reason to depart from this.</p>
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		<title>By: Jax</title>
		<link>http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/2005/05/27/i-can-complain-too/#comment-5646</link>
		<dc:creator>Jax</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 May 2005 07:22:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=869#comment-5646</guid>
		<description>And this is where I have to respond.  For someone who is self-employed, they are effectively paying any time they have to take time off work - a situation that also applies to a number of the more vulnerable workers in society who don't get paid sick leave and so on.  So they, the ppl who can often least afford to wait for an extra two hours, get stung all ways round.  Is that fair?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And this is where I have to respond.  For someone who is self-employed, they are effectively paying any time they have to take time off work - a situation that also applies to a number of the more vulnerable workers in society who don&#8217;t get paid sick leave and so on.  So they, the ppl who can often least afford to wait for an extra two hours, get stung all ways round.  Is that fair?</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/2005/05/27/i-can-complain-too/#comment-5645</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 May 2005 05:55:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=869#comment-5645</guid>
		<description>Well I guess we disagree. Would I really want to pay personally for 25% of my health care cost just so I didn't have to wait for 2 hours in a hospital waiting room.......er no. At least if I have to wait I can, not sure I could find 25% of the cost of my last asthma related stay in hospital at the drop of a hat.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well I guess we disagree. Would I really want to pay personally for 25% of my health care cost just so I didn&#8217;t have to wait for 2 hours in a hospital waiting room&#8230;&#8230;.er no. At least if I have to wait I can, not sure I could find 25% of the cost of my last asthma related stay in hospital at the drop of a hat.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim</title>
		<link>http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/2005/05/27/i-can-complain-too/#comment-5642</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 May 2005 23:50:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=869#comment-5642</guid>
		<description>Well, not quite. The % of GDP spent on healthcare in the UK and Belgium are quite similar. So using your speaker analogy it would be more like having two £1K CD players and amps one of which is crap.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, not quite. The % of GDP spent on healthcare in the UK and Belgium are quite similar. So using your speaker analogy it would be more like having two £1K CD players and amps one of which is crap.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/2005/05/27/i-can-complain-too/#comment-5640</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 May 2005 23:19:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=869#comment-5640</guid>
		<description>Never really considered it. If I could compare different health care systems with the same resource levels then perhaps I could judge. I don't know how one can judge between the British and Belgian health care systems if one has twice as many resources as the other.

It's a bit like trying to compare two pairs of speakers where one is being driven by a £1k CD player and Amp and the other a by a £500 CD player and Amp.  How can you tell what of what you hear is the difference between the speakers and what is the difference between the sources.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Never really considered it. If I could compare different health care systems with the same resource levels then perhaps I could judge. I don&#8217;t know how one can judge between the British and Belgian health care systems if one has twice as many resources as the other.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a bit like trying to compare two pairs of speakers where one is being driven by a £1k CD player and Amp and the other a by a £500 CD player and Amp.  How can you tell what of what you hear is the difference between the speakers and what is the difference between the sources.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim</title>
		<link>http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/2005/05/27/i-can-complain-too/#comment-5632</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 May 2005 21:42:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=869#comment-5632</guid>
		<description>So you think we should scrap the NHS then?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So you think we should scrap the NHS then?</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/2005/05/27/i-can-complain-too/#comment-5631</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 May 2005 21:18:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=869#comment-5631</guid>
		<description>Yeah I'd much rather be treated under the Belgian system too. They have more than 100% more doctors and more than 100% more nurses per capita than the in the UK.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah I&#8217;d much rather be treated under the Belgian system too. They have more than 100% more doctors and more than 100% more nurses per capita than the in the UK.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim</title>
		<link>http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/2005/05/27/i-can-complain-too/#comment-5630</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 May 2005 19:39:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=869#comment-5630</guid>
		<description>I must admit, it struck me that the kind of measures referenced (infant mortality and life expectancy, for example) might be much more attributable to sanitation and living conditions than to healthcare.

"For decades, the alibi for the NHS’ failure to meet the expectations – and the needs – of patients has been a supposed lack of funding. Despite the evidence from across the Channel that almost any other method is more successful at giving patients what they require, the NHS’ cheerleaders have been able to live in a political comfort zone." 

"I would much rather be treated under the Belgian system than I would under the NHS, it’s a “no brainer” as they say."

Both quotes are Stephem Pollard, New Labour ‘guru’,  &lt;a href="http://www.cne.org/pub_pdf/2004_11_25_Pollard_NHS.pdf"&gt;more here&lt;/a&gt;

You know that I am no fan of New (the party formerly known as Labour), but a lot of what Pollard has to say makes considerable sense to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I must admit, it struck me that the kind of measures referenced (infant mortality and life expectancy, for example) might be much more attributable to sanitation and living conditions than to healthcare.</p>
<p>&#8220;For decades, the alibi for the NHS’ failure to meet the expectations – and the needs – of patients has been a supposed lack of funding. Despite the evidence from across the Channel that almost any other method is more successful at giving patients what they require, the NHS’ cheerleaders have been able to live in a political comfort zone.&#8221; </p>
<p>&#8220;I would much rather be treated under the Belgian system than I would under the NHS, it’s a “no brainer” as they say.&#8221;</p>
<p>Both quotes are Stephem Pollard, New Labour ‘guru’,  <a href="http://www.cne.org/pub_pdf/2004_11_25_Pollard_NHS.pdf">more here</a></p>
<p>You know that I am no fan of New (the party formerly known as Labour), but a lot of what Pollard has to say makes considerable sense to me.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/2005/05/27/i-can-complain-too/#comment-5628</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 May 2005 13:34:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=869#comment-5628</guid>
		<description>Do you think Germany's system would be so good if they had the same number of doctors per 1000 of population as the UK? They have about 50% more.

You see I'd argue that the problems with the NHS are in the main about trying to deliver a service with an inadequate resource. I am not saying there isn't inefficiency and incompetence (and removing that needs to be done), there is any organisation and should be addressed. But to say that your wait (when compared to the service in the private sector or Germany) is due to incompetency is I believe wrong.

Germany spends 50 per cent more of their GDP on healthcare than the UK. Their life expectancy is the same. Not sure how one compares impact of care on health of the nation,
so not sure how it can be demonstrated that their healthcare system is more than 50% better in VFM terms than UK. A number of academic papers comparing health systems find that the UK is better (marginally). http://www.davidgratzer.com/report1/5.html for example, but I don't understand the methodology enough to know if these have any real meaning.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Do you think Germany&#8217;s system would be so good if they had the same number of doctors per 1000 of population as the UK? They have about 50% more.</p>
<p>You see I&#8217;d argue that the problems with the NHS are in the main about trying to deliver a service with an inadequate resource. I am not saying there isn&#8217;t inefficiency and incompetence (and removing that needs to be done), there is any organisation and should be addressed. But to say that your wait (when compared to the service in the private sector or Germany) is due to incompetency is I believe wrong.</p>
<p>Germany spends 50 per cent more of their GDP on healthcare than the UK. Their life expectancy is the same. Not sure how one compares impact of care on health of the nation,<br />
so not sure how it can be demonstrated that their healthcare system is more than 50% better in VFM terms than UK. A number of academic papers comparing health systems find that the UK is better (marginally). <a href="http://www.davidgratzer.com/report1/5.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.davidgratzer.com/report1/5.html</a> for example, but I don&#8217;t understand the methodology enough to know if these have any real meaning.</p>
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		<title>By: Heather</title>
		<link>http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/2005/05/27/i-can-complain-too/#comment-5626</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 May 2005 11:37:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=869#comment-5626</guid>
		<description>I don't know :-)
Hope you get another appointment soon.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know <img src='http://liveotherwise.co.uk/makingitup/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
Hope you get another appointment soon.</p>
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